Jump to content

DiversitySMP suggestion (reset)


Regina
 Share

Recommended Posts

 

Dear DiversitySMP staff and players, 

    Recently, with the current state of the server and the issues we face while playing, I, along with some others, have been brainstorming some ways that this could possibly be fixed. We all found Diversity and decided to play for similar reasons. A friendly, community based server that doesn’t reset? Sounds amazing. However, it’s been over 7 years since the server started. As time has gone on, Div has changed a lot from what it used to be. The fact that everybody is already established and the common goal of “beating minecraft” is gone, it’s extremely hard to feel as though there is any sort of community on the server. I know for a fact many newer players feel discouraged to play on SMP because of this. Afterall, it’s hard to play on a server where many have spent years gathering what they have and you’re just barely starting out. This is why I think it would be a really good idea to start possibly considering a reset of the SMP world. As someone who has played since 2015 and has made a lot of progress on the server over the past 6 years, I know it’s gonna be hard for many older players to be comfortable with the idea of resetting, but it genuinely needs to happen eventually. 

    This idea has been brought up multiple times and each time it’s been shut down because of the fact that Diversity prides itself on being a server that doesn’t reset, and quite frankly, they fear that many players would leave if it were to reset. That’s understandable, DiversitySMP’s player count has definitely gone down over the years, but that’s because hardly any of the new players that join are actually staying. Which, once again, is because of the major divide between new and old players, and the lack of a common goal. 

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

As much as many of us don’t want to admit it, there are multiple ways in which resetting the server would actually do a lot more good than harm.


The server costs would decrease massively. 

  • The current cost of the server is approximately $300 a month, which Div used to be able to handle before the donations slowly started to diminish. Currently, the cost of the server is basically being covered by Zore alone, which has to be pretty hard. 

The lag would also decrease massively. 

  • Having less chunks that are loaded/explored will help the performance of the server drastically. This kinda also raises the question of the world border and whether or not it’s too big. Honestly, everybody I have spoken to has agreed that the world border is a bit big and could easily be lowered to 100k. That way there aren’t as many chunks being loaded at once and the lag really wouldn’t be that bad.

The server would actually be able to update to 1.17. 

  • The massive changes to the generation of chunks that come with 1.17 is going to quite literally break the server. As excited as everyone is to update, there’s no way that SMP could handle it without a complete reset. With that being said, while resetting the server right away would be nice, there’s no actual reason to do it until we plan on updating to 1.17. I think that giving players a heads-up a few months before resetting would be a really good idea. 

Lastly, what do we do with everyone’s hard work? Does it just disappear?

  • Absolutely not! Nobody should have to lose all of their hard work. This is why DiversitySMP should let people get copies of their work in its current state before the reset, that way everyone still has access to it and can continue their projects.

    In conclusion, I would really appreciate it if the DiversitySMP staff would consider this request, even if it’s not approved, it would still be nice to get your feedback. Any players who have any ideas or input, please feel free to respond to this post. I’d love to hear everyone’s opinions. 
 

Edited by Regina
  • Love 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Some great points on the benefits of resetting the world.

Personally, I have played on many servers that felt like they had a strong sense of community with smaller map-sizes within walking distance of other players, and community-built towns and projects, but they all seem to go through a peak where they are popular with lots of new people joining and playing, then over time only a few regulars remain before eventually dying off completely. One of the issues seems to be when people of similar age (in elementary or high school, with lots of free time to play Minecraft) begin to grow up, graduate, get full times jobs or start pursuing post-secondary education. There just isn’t enough free time for playing Minecraft at that stage in life and I fear that as most of our regular players are reaching this point, the server may die off regardless of whether we reset the map for new players or not.

The current difficulty rating of the server may also be an issue. Most new players seem to play for a bit then are discouraged as soon as night hits with the swarms of mobs, particularly the zombie gangs. I tried to get my young niece to play (She was 11 when I got her to join the server) and she immediately no longer wanted to play after night hit, and she died (I offered to help her get established but she wasn’t really interested and went back to her Skyblock server lol). Everyone has a play-style that they prefer and since we have multiple server worlds, they may be coming to play Creative or Skyblock, then see it is level restricted with a requirement to play SMP first, and then leave. 

Another issue I have seen is that the word “Diversity” is highly associated with the Complete the Monument (CTM) adventure map in Minecraft. While it is sometimes funny that a lot of new players ask, “Where’s the parkour?”, or “How do I get to the puzzle map?”, it really hurts to see players join and leave so quickly as they came with the sole goal of playing the CTM. I wonder if we should also consider a name-change so people searching online don’t associate our server with the CTM, or perhaps add another word so that we are unique from the map: “<Blank> Diversity” or “Diversity <Blank>”. That way we could keep our current logo without too many changes and still have the original roots and ideologies of the server.

This also brings up another issue of getting the server’s name out there. Voting is one of the only ways I know of for advertising since most servers have rules about not advertising other servers and none of us have large social media followings such as YouTube or Twitch to reach a larger audience of new players. I try to make sure to vote once every day to get the server higher up on the lists but my measly 20-25 votes a month cannot compete with the hundreds of votes very popular servers get.

It also certainly is not fair to Zore to be paying for the upkeep of the server from his own pocket though I, and I’m sure many of us, greatly appreciate and cannot thank Zore enough for keeping the server up when he could have just dropped us all in order to pocket that money or spend it on other things (Thank you so much, Zore! We all love you and appreciate all the hard work you have done to keep the server up for us to have somewhere safe and friendly to spend our free time and escape from reality for a while, especially during the pandemic). The current map world in its entirety is too large to be downloaded for individuals to use, though I do agree with the number of large world generation changes being made in the next update, this would be a great time to start a fresh world as much as it would pain me and many of our other long time players. I would certainly be open to the idea of resetting if there’s a way to get a copy of my build to use in single player. I am very slow creatively and enjoy taking my time with building. The fact that we haven’t reset has allowed me to slowly build something much larger than I normally would have without being un-motivated by an imminent world reset. 

I hope we are able to come up with some solutions in the future, and hope to continue to play with you all for many years to come!

Thanks for reading my thoughts.

 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm all caught up on this, read all of the responses on Discord as well (seriously, why does no one use the forum? lol) - thanks to @KatieBug555 for bringing this to my attention!

Personally, I'm against removal of the original Diversity worlds, in any form.

But I do agree that Diversity needs a reset.

I did suggest this before I stood down as admin but it gained no traction.

My idea was to keep the current server active but direct new players to a new server. Original players could still play the old server and it would be restricted to only them - newer players could upgrade their account to gain build access on the server if they wanted, this could help with financials.
A new server would be a great restart for the community without upsetting any long term players.

I understand this is very expensive to keep running, so I'm happy to begin donating $100 a month to help keep Diversity alive, as long as the world is kept intact.

Would love to hear @Zoredache's opinion on this.

 

Edited by Turbotailz
Found a link to my suggestion
  • Like 6
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have been trying to wait, to let you all get you say in, we have had this discussion on staff channels, in the forum, discord and so on many times in the last few years.

But here is my current opinion.

> Reset the main SMP world?

I am not going be the one to reset the main SMP world. I would probably just quit, and as far as I know there isn't anyone else available that has the skills, interest, and funds that I would be willing to transfer the server too.

> 1.18 potential upgrade problems

Next 1.18 is going to be a massive world change because of the height changes. I have no idea what is or what will need to happen to support 1.18. Mojang hasn't officially released it yet, and spigot/paper haven't made any suggestions about how a transition will happen. It might not be possible to upgrade the main SMP world to 1.18, or maybe it will. I am not going to spend time right now making promises or guesses about what will have to happen to support software that hasn't been released yet.

> Server costs

Currently we are renting a pair of servers from OVH. We have had these two servers for a couple years, there is a newer server available that I have been thinking about upgrading too. That could be less expensive.

Current servers cost $273/mo

- srv-05 RAM 64GB, CPU i7-6700K, Storage two 1TB SSD + 3TB HDD
- srv-06 RAM 64GB, CPU i7-6700K, Storage two 500GB SSD + 3TB HDD

The new server I would have to setup without using RAID1, which probably will only worry me.  Without storage redudancy, if the drives fail, it would take weeks for me to re-upload 1.5TB of backups I have on my home computer.

- Potential new server CPU Ryzen 7 5800X, RAM 128GB, two 1TB NVME + one 4TB HDD

Last time I checked this was like $210/mo, but OVH is currently out of stock at this moment, but I am hoping the server I have been looking at will be available again later this month, or maybe in September.

I haven't done this earlier because I haven't wanted to replace the server until the next version (11.x) of Debian is out.  Debian is used as the base operating system. It then runs docker and ~50 containers for all the various services. Upgrading in place is a pain, it is easier to bring up a new server on 11.x, and transfer everything over to the new server. So I have been waiting for the official release before I upgrade the hardware.

> Additional survival server/world.

Turbo is right, we have discussed this in the past. Some staff have been strongly against it, some where for it, and I believe I have more or less been in the middle. I am not completely opposed to it, but I believe there are some potential problems with it. since I think it will add a lot more work to staff, which I try to avoid.

If we were to create an additional SMP server world I would be strongly against.

- Any kind of linked inventory
- Any copying of builds, farms etc

I will not add actually another smp server until I get an upgraded server hardware and base operating system.

Having another SMP server will potentially be confusing for new players. I am not sure how to handle this.

Having another SMP server will potentially require more staff effort. It will basically be more places for staff to check for griefing of public spaces, players will be more spread out so checking for and finding griefers will be more of a pain.

If we started a new world, I would be strongly tempted to remove or heavily restrict the wilds/random teleport from the old SMP to discourage more exploring and growth.

If we were to start another world I would want to remove or replace some of the plugins that have been causing the most problems.

Plugins I think must go

  • Autorank
    • This is our player rank system. But it is also constantly breaking the database. It is not reliably cross-server.
    •  Waiting for a relaible and stable versio of this has been the biggest cause of deplays in the last 2-3 updates.
    •  But I have no idea how to handle rank up without this plugin. Or what to do instead.
  •  Shopkeepers
    • The shopkeeper plugin unfortunately also tends to update very slowly, and because it is strongly linked to our economy, if this plugin breaks it causes chaos.
    • What do we use instead?
    • I will not support any plugin where staff defines pricing. Pricing needs to be set by players.
  • AddLight 
    •  I think this got added for some staff creative stuff
  • NoTrample 
    • shouldn't be required with recent worldguard
  • GriefPrevention
    • This plugin actually isn't supported anymore. You basically have to use unofficial forks these days
    •  But what should I use as an alternative?
    • Worldguard supports claims, but it is less user-friendly
    • There was another plugin similar to Griefprotect we were looking at, but I have never been get it to correctly import the old data. But it might be fine on a new world.

Plugins that are mostly likely fine

Advanced-Portals AsyncWorldEdit AutoMessage BanManagerBukkit BBeeChecker BetterRTP BlocksHub BungeeTabListPlus_BukkitBridge BuycraftX CoreProtect DeluxeChat DiscordSRV DurabilityAlert Dynmap EssentialsX EssentialsXProtect EssentialsXSpawn ExtraContexts FarmLimiter HolographicDisplays HorseTpWithMe JoinDate LuckPerms Multiverse-Core Multiverse-NetherPortals Nicky nuvotifier PhantomX PlaceholderAPI PluginLibrary ProtocolLib ProxyTicketsBukkit SAML ServerSigns SuperbVote TitleManager UltimateTimber Vault ViaVersion VoidGenerator WitherSound worldedit-bukkit worldguard-bukkit WorldGuardExtraFlags

 

  • Like 4
Link to comment
Share on other sites

There's been a lot of discussion this week about a reset, community, and new players. After ruminating on this all week, I'd like to weigh in as a new player in search of community.

I've been playing Minecraft for a year - this is my first public server, and my first time building in survival. I joined several months ago because I was tired of playing alone and needed a constant reminder that other people were still out there. What I found was overwhelming kindness and generosity. Players /tp'd to dress me in fully spelled netherite to stop my constant deaths. I was rescued and assisted more times than I can remember. I was given tours of incredible builds that took years of thoughtful dedication. Other players offered to help me build, and even left gifts in my house. I was encouraged to ask questions, and ASK FOR HELP. Every time I logged on I was welcomed back, and the chat was always full of "Welcome" and witty banter. 

It's been hard for me to find the energy to play this week under the cloud of a reset. I'd be sad to see those monuments lost, and I'm overwhelmed by the idea of starting over, but I'd do it to stay a part of the Diversity Community I joined. That is why I'm speaking up. 

I never expected Diversity to be the kind of place where a request not to use "pussy" as a slur would be mocked and dismissed. I did not expect to see players threatened, cheated, or their builds intentionally destroyed by other players. I did not expect to see bullying, petty infighting, or sexual harassment here. I also never expected to join a Minecraft Discord chat with kids in it and see someone asking to have their "watersports" fetish fulfilled- I know the server is intended for 18+, but read the fucking room. I enjoy good sexual innuendo as much as the next 84 year old woman, but in the immortal words of Ron Burgundy, "Stay Classy, Diversity."

Here are my humble suggestions:

1) "No" means NO. 

2) "Please stop" means STOP NOW.

3) No name calling. 

4) Keep your hands to yourself. 

5) If it is not yours, do not touch it.

6) Don't post your kinks in the general Discord.

And lastly, let's have more build competitions. I was too shy to enter the last one. 

 

All My Love,

Nerf N. Turf

  • Love 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Zoredache featured and pinned this topic
On 8/6/2021 at 12:03 AM, Zoredache said:

If we were to create an additional SMP server world I would be strongly against.

- Any kind of linked inventory
- Any copying of builds, farms etc

I feel in the event that we keep the current world on one spot, and adding an additional one that has the reset that any sort of linked inventory should definitely be a no go. 

The idea of a reset is a scary thought for a lot, because of how much progress has been made it hurts to kind of walk away from it and start again. but i feel for the benefit of the server as a whole a reset would be immensely beneficial as it would be an opportunity to  set a smaller world border that can encourage a more community based world. and have less rendered at once, as well as give the chance to change out select Plugins that are causing problems, or even just upgrade some to better systems such as the ranking system. 

All of the above would be greatly beneficial for the server and its players as although it comes at a cost of a new world, and starting again, all the pesky issues that are frustrating players . As well as turning away new ones for reasons like the server difficulty due to its age, and being a fresh spawn while others have fully automated farms of EVERYTHING available is quite discouraging. 

Unfortunately is a sad scenario, but is a sacrifice I personally  feel is worth giving up the progress and starting again, to get some more stability and hopefully help grow the community some more

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 4 weeks later...

Considering the fact that Zore is against copying builds between the current world and the new one, I am therefore strongly against any sort of world reset. I understand the technical strains having a non-reset world has, but Diversity having a world that was promised to never be reset was one of the largest selling factors to me joining in the first place. Too often have I poured countless hours into builds and towns, only for the owner of the server to decide one day that its time to throw it all away. Diversity promised me that I would never have to worry about such a thing happening. As such, if it were to happen, I doubt I would ever return. Because then, what would the point be, if it were to just be reset again anyway?

I propose an alternate solution. However, due to my inexperience in operating a Minecraft server, I have no idea how practical it would be to do, if even possible at all. In any case, I say that you let individuals submit their builds (or anyone elses they wish to keep if the owner of those builds are absent) to be preserved. Give players like a 3 month window to do this. Then, at the end of the window, reset all of the chunks that were not registered, keeping only ones people requested to keep. This would erase insignificant builds in the middle of nowhere as well as chunks that were only loaded once when someone did a Wilds warp. It could also theoretically erase chunks between two builds that are otherwise unimportant. Again like I said I have no idea how or if this could be done. But it would give players the relief that their stuff was not at risk along with historical builds being preserved. It would just trim the map of unnecessary loaded chunks with nothing in them. Feel free to say "uh dwur thats not how it works." I'm just spitballing ideas here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now
 Share

×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.